(no subject)

[ceitean]

In reaction to the impossibility of the Fall being both Watanuki and Himawari's fault, pasted together from comments I left on other communities:

Actually (because I've been thinking about this) it might be possible for the falling out the window thing to be caused by both Watanuki's unconscious death wish and Himawari's bad luck, as long as you take a broader view.

You know how everyone asks Watanuki why he likes Himawari? And he never really gives a good, solid answer besides 'she's cute'? I think Watanuki liking Himawari in the first place is part of that unconscious desire to off himself. Some part of him (that he ignores)is attracted to things that are bad for him.

Look back at the story with the fridge that was a dud. Out of all the fridges in that store, he would have picked the one that had something wrong with it. After Yuuko tells him to look again, Watanuki can suddenly see the 'bad stuff' around it and replies that he doesn't want the fridge anymore. That he doesn't want the fridge/can finally see the bad stuff is due to the changes he went through, which, in my mind, boil down to him not IGNORING things that are bad for him like he would have in the past.

Now take this situation and apply it to Himawari. It makes a creepy kind of sense that if Watanuki was really trying to erase his own existence he would attract things that would do the job for him, like all the bad ghosts and Himawari.

So it's this attraction to Himawari that cause him to constantly want to be in her presence, which would up the chance of his fortune going bad. Like it did.

Looked at from this perspective, it was Himawari's bad luck that caused the fall, but it never would have happened if Watanuki wasn't subconsciously attracted to things that are bad for him.

The corollary to all this is that if Watanuki is attracted to things that are bad for him, he might then be repelled by things that are good for him, ie Doumeki. We're told time and time again that Doumeki makes Watanuki's life better in general, but Watanuki's first emotional reaction to the other boy is RAGE HATE RAGE. Really, it's another subconscious reaction that would achieve the same end result as the attraction to Himawari.

Himawari/bad things= Sparkles of Love while Doumeki/good thing= Massive Irritation.

My two cents. ^_^   .

Comments

random commenter here o/

[mairenn-k.livejournal.com]

Hi, and sorry for bumping in. ;; I came here after seeing your post in the multi-fandom meme and this entry caught my attention. I've had the same idea myself (actually I made an entry (http://mairenn-k.livejournal.com/10628.html#cutid1) about it some time ago), and I think it makes a lot of sense that it was Watanuki's unconscious wish to stop existing that made him act the way he did towards both Himawari and Doumeki. By now I think that his feelings for them both are truly genuine though.

Anyway, the initial reason why I came here was because I noticed that we have several interests in common. So... um, would you be interested in being friends? *shy*

Re: random commenter here o/

[ceitean.livejournal.com]

Oh, I definetly agree with you! And I'm really glad I found people who see it the same way, the first people I talked to about this particualr story arc didn't get what I was trying to say .*tear* This post is actually a copy of me originally trying to tell someone else about it; I just figured I'd also put in my journal. ^_^;;

Yeah, you can really really see the difference in how Watanuki approaches Himawari and Doumeki now as compared to before. It just seems more genuine. And I really think that now Watanuki likes Himawari for her own merits and not just just because of his own issues, you can tell when he finally calls her on not ever being able to go out.

And, heh. I read your entry (which I agree with WHOLEHEARTEDLY btw) and I'm with you in hoping that maybe there's some shippyness there with Watanuki's reactions. At least the possibility of it. For god's sake, it makes sense.

And I'm glad you want to be friends! :D I'm very, very shy about the whole friending thing, so I'm always pathetically glad when someone else makes the first overture. XD XD Friends!

[mairenn-k.livejournal.com]

Haha, thank you. I'm terribly shy about friending people myself, but I thought I'd be brave this time. xD

Yes, I reread the first few volumes of Holic a while ago, and the difference in how Watanuki acted when he was around the others is really striking. Also, it seems like a very CLAMP-ish thing to do, giving little hints like the ones about Watanuki reacting with immediate anger the first time he ever met Doumeki, feeling irritated just by seeing his face, etc. And while I sometimes find it difficult to remain 100% unbiased and objective when it comes to my favorite couples (though I pretty much ship everyone with everyone in Holic at this point XD;), I agree that it really would make sense. :)

[kairi-jaganshi.livejournal.com]

This is a very intriguing post to say the least. XD I actually never considered that Watanuki's fall could be a combination of his unconcious desire to die and Himawari-chan's bad luck. It makes sense too, though it is really creepy like you said. o__o;;

And your take on Watanuki's relationship with Doumeki is equally intriguing. I don't know if you've read the spin-off novel by NISIOISIN called xxxHOLiC: AnotherHOLiC, but in it a man appears before Watanuki. He has this strange ability to repel certain people (I'm not sure of the specifics, I'd have to reread it.) and one of them was Doumeki. Now when Doumeki wasn't around, and Watanuki was hanging around this man he felt no animosity towards Doumeki whatsoever. None of that RAGE HATE RAGE he's so infamous for in the series, he actually likes Doumeki for a short time while he's with that man. And when the man leaves and Doumeki comes back to school he hates him all over again.

This post and that novel have got me thinking now: what do you suppose Doumeki and Watanuki's relationship would be like if Watanuki no longer wanted to unconciously kill himself? Would Watanuki actually like Doumeki and be friendly with him instead of acting like the Watanuki we all know around Doumeki?

P.S.
I found your LJ through my comm xcrystallisx when you requested to join. I took a look at your profile to see that it fit the requirements, and was intrigued by your layout. Because I'm always keeping an eye out for pretty layouts. And then saw this post. :D I've also friended you, if that's okay. XD

I'm no stalker, I just found this post extremely interesting and at the time I had no other way to save/meme this since I was in a hurry. So I just friended you so I could come back later and check out your LJ fully. And now I have. You're free to friend me if you like as well. :D

Also? If anything in this comment sounds funny it's because I lost the comment three times before I finally managed to get this out. @___@ *kicks computer*

[ceitean.livejournal.com]

Oh gosh, this took forever to reply to, I'm sorry! (family emergency, Mardi Gras, busy busy busy)

Though, haha, I actually had a reply typed out last week? Right before I had to hop on a plane, and then LJ ate it. -_- I feel your pain.

So wait, they brought this up in a Holic novel? REALLY? :D Gosh, I love validation.

(also, i didn't know there were Holic novels. XD)

...he likes Doumeki? Wow, really? How did he show it? Was it a, 'he's not so bad' kinda thing? <--intrigued.

You know, I really think we're at the place where Watanuki is starting to like Doumeki for his own merits. It started with the Lady in the Park, went on to the Eye thing, and the thank you after that. I really think even knowing Haruka (who looks exactly like Doumeki, and no, that's not suspicious at all) has steered Watanuki to a place where he and Doumeki can (eventually) get along very well.

The last 'fight' I recall them having was when they were talking about what went down in the TV station with Kohane. Talk about having two conversations at once. :D (Or two conversations that are really two dimensions of the same conversation, but whatever. They communicate through food, who's surprised about that. ^_^ ) Watanuki only gets spazzy at the end, and even then, it's like...a good natured spazzy, you know? Since then, I haven't felt any real animosity between them at all.

Which, actually, just goes to show that the story is reaching it's final stretch (as if the crazyness in Tsubasa wasn't a clue). :(

(oh god, now I wish Watanuki had said something earlier like, 'the only way i'd ever like that guy would be if it were the end of the wolrd!!')


PS

Friending is fun! :D Though I have a story for you.

So a couple weeks ago I got the Friend notification from you and I was all smiling, 'Yay! Someone friended me! :D D :D It is a good day.'

And then I saw that you were the mod for a community I had just joined which said journals were checked before you could join. So I then thought that, you know, you had friended me for a little bit just to make sure you weren't letting in a crazy axe murderer into your community or something, and I was sad.

But this makes me happy! :D

[kairi-jaganshi.livejournal.com]

It's alright, I know all about RL problems. @___@ As for comment loss, my aunt falenimortal117 and I have coined an acronym for it: ECL or...

Epic
Comment
Loss

XD

And yes, yes they did. ♥ I had a moment of fangirlyness because of it. :D As for xxxHOLiC novels, there's only one so far. I would HIGHLY recommend reading it though. NISIOISIN managed to completely capture the world CLAMP has created and I was very impressed. :D

Yes he does! :D I can't remember exactly what he said/thought (My friend has my book so I'll get it next time I see her and check it.) but it was basically Watanuki realizing, "Hey, he isn't so bad. :D I don't know why I hated him, he's a good classmate/friend!" And then of course this all flies out the window when Doumeki comes back. XD

I agree, though I'm of the theory that Watanuki actually liked Doumeki all before this (I mean he had no reason to hate him really.) but because of his MASSIVE pride he wouldn't let himself think/say it. But with all the incidents throughout xxxHOLiC that you mentioned, he's slowly admitting it to himself and to Doumeki whether he realizes it or not. :D

I also totally forgot about the whole TV station thing. XD; I agree though, it was more of a good!spazz. Kind of like Watanuki realized he forgot to be all RAGE HATE RAGE to Doumeki and spazzed out last minute so Doumeki wouldn't let on.

Omg I knoooooow. D:< The stuff going down in TRC is like, "adhafkdfja HOSHIT o__o;;" I'm so worried for everyone. ;___; Thank god we already know Watanuki's origins, I would be so pissed if he turned out to be a feather or some crap like that. XD;

You know what? I think he did say something like that! :O I'm not 100% sure, but I think he might have said it at one point. Or at least something similar. XD

P.S.
Hahaha, don't worry, I friend people because we have the same interests/fandoms/etc. Not to check I haven't let any crazies in my comm. lol And I'm glad that made you happy! ♥

[anyjen.livejournal.com]

...you know, this is the exact same conclusion I reached. You even went through the same reasoning process. Girl, you and I do seem to have a lot in common. :)

The funny thing would be for Watanuki to realize this and to start simply getting close to the people he dislikes. He would end up with all good friends that way. XD

[ceitean.livejournal.com]

You know, your comment made me think about this, but Watanuki doesn't really have this problem with anyone else, does he? Yuuko, yeah, but she provokes him. The extremes of feeling he has around Doumeki and Himawari aren't repeated with anyone else. Hmmm, maybe Kohane, but that's...more sad?

Anyway. Watanuki's pretty nuetral to everyone else that he's met in the series.

(I kind of want him to meet Kurogane and Fai now, XD)

[anyjen.livejournal.com]

...hm, maybe this only applies in the cases where people have some sort of supernatural influence (either good or bad)? He was really drawn to the lady in the park, after all, and he seemed somewhat freaked out by Mugetsu at first (though who wouldn't, when you think about it)

[ceitean.livejournal.com]

SPEAKING OF MUGETSU. Where'd that pipe fox get to, anyway? Am I completely blanking on something that happened in the manga? Where is he?

[anyjen.livejournal.com]

...that's actually a good question. He hasn't shown up in a while... Maybe he's just sleeping inside his pipe?